PDA

View Full Version : Strange Rover rebuild



Frank84
05-03-2012, 06:22 PM
I figure it is time to start a thread to get some discussions going in the range rover section here on my slow progress with my rebuild. I'm basically trying to make it so I don't break down every time I drive it. However, despite the unbelievable number of times it has broken it has always eventually made it home under it's own power.

A rebuild on the "Strange Rover" is actually a challenge of a different sort because I don't want to make it perfect necessarily so i'm not doing anything cosmetically on the vehicle except for fixing rust and replacing the knackered rear bumper. It has a lot of quirks, even for an older rover, and I don't really want to get rid of all of them - just the really bad ones . I plan to create new quirks wherever possible as long as they are mostly good. And since I'm doing as much of the work as I can myself with used/rebuilt parts, I'm sure this will not be a challenge nor intentional most of the time.

My plans for 2012 roughly involve the following:

300 Tdi install
R380 install
LT230 w/ crawler box install

new suspension bushings
rust repair on the body
de-gunk and waxoyl the underside
eliminate vague steering
new brakes (rebuild calipers, new master, brake booster, rotors/pads, flex lines, etc)
fix all of the somewhat necessary electrical accessories (power windows, seats, etc)
and about a million little things
and maybe new tires if my bank account is still functioning

Frank84
05-03-2012, 06:51 PM
I bought the engine, transmission, and an install kit from Jim at Redhawk Rovers. He was great to deal with, low pressure, and very honest. It all arrived on a pallet from Colorado just before Christmas last year. Jim replaced the timing belt before shipping it and I did all the seals (minus head gasket), water pump, etc, etc after it arrived with the kit he sent. I did not rebuild the engine - I just replaced all the wear and tear stuff and I added a EGR port in the exhaust manifold and oil pressure sender so i can have a real gauge.

I rebuilt the transmission with new bearings and synchros and replaced a few other worn looking parts. It would definitely have worked as-is for a while but I'll feel better knowing it has been gone through because there was some wear on parts. Achcroft was great for getting all the internal bits though shipping from England will set you back a bit. Rebuilding an R380 is within the ability of anyone with patience, creativity, a good tool set, press, and some gear pullers. You'll also want a camera so you have a chance at putting it back together afterward and the shop manual so you do it right.

Frank84
05-03-2012, 07:03 PM
I got the LT230 from Randy a while back and had intentions of installing it "right away" but it didn't happen for reasons I don't remember. While it was on the bench I decided to open it up and see what things looked like and was happy to find everything in good working order. I re-sealed it and added the under drive from Ashcroft which was easy to install onto the transfer case but will require some mods to the floor pan to fit. The shifter can be made or bought. I simply re-used a borg warner t-case shifter I had on a shelf with a few very minor mods.

Taking the LT230 apart to re-seal it (not replacing bearings/gears) is rather easy if you have it out of the car for whatever reason. Ashcroft recommended I use RTV and new input/output seals rather than the gasket kit which makes it a pretty inexpensive undertaking as well as long as you don't add an under drive at the same time.

Frank84
05-03-2012, 07:15 PM
Right now, the old V8/auto/borg warner drivetrain is still nestled in my frame but it won't be for too much longer. I have the interior stripped out for various reasons and the fuel system is getting a makeover to fix what is broken/deteriorating and to convert it for use with the diesel systems. To convert it, you need to remove the neck-reducing-insert thing in the filler pipe, remove the electric in-tank fuel pump and replace with a tube, replace the stock in-line filter with tube, and block off the line running from the charcoal canister toward the back of the truck. Then you're ready to hook up the diesel parts.

I'd seriously recommend that people consider making the rear floor pan removable if you have an old rangie. The access to the under side is amazing! If you don't have carpet like me, just drill out the two dozen or so rivets that hold it in place and replace them with hex head 1/4-14 stainless steel sheet metal screws from McMaster for quick access on the trail.

Disco96JSWB
05-03-2012, 09:37 PM
Looks good Frank. That floor idea is brilliant.

Frank84
05-03-2012, 09:38 PM
The broken picture is not mine but I figured I'd pirate someone's idea and I welded a plate on for some extra protection. Supposedly, this is not an issue on the V8 ones because they have thicker, cast clutch forks unlike the thin, stamped Tdi ones.

Frank84
05-03-2012, 09:53 PM
Here's a picture of the insert in the filler neck that has to come out. I think some later models and/or disco's have a plastic insert that is easier to remove. Believe me - the metal one was a b*tch!

Diesel nozzles at gas stations are larger diameter than petrol ones so you can do this or carry a funnel.

Frank84
05-03-2012, 09:55 PM
Looks good Frank. That floor idea is brilliant.

Thanks - do disco's have the same floor?

Frank84
05-03-2012, 10:05 PM
I got a used clutch master cylinder still attached to the RHD Disco pedal box from Red Hawk Rovers. Rebuilding it only cost about $10 if I remember right and was quick and easy. If the internal bore looks to be in good shape replacement seals should make it good as new. I'm not brave enough to try rebuilding the brake master cylinder yet since it is safety related - I bought a new one of those.

Frank84
05-03-2012, 10:15 PM
The install kit I got included an EGR blanking kit. I later removed it and installed the threaded bung for the temperature probe.

Frank84
05-03-2012, 10:35 PM
One of the problems with used parts it that they are...ummm...not new. Expect to rebuild some stuff now or later. Now is easier very often.

The radiator that I got could have been cleaned and used for a while but i believe it was at the end of its useful life so I got it re-cored locally at Hawthorne Radiator. Jim at Red Hawk Rovers also hooked me up with a 200 Tdi disco fan shroud which is one piece versus the later 2 piece 300 tdi ones. Either will fit, though the 200 tdi one required drilling two new holes for the mounting screws in the radiator frame. I think the 2 piece is supposed to be easier to remove but Jim didn't have any of those and his price (free!) was hard to beat on the 200 tdi version.

The intercooler was in good shape but was kind of gunked up inside so I did a few cycles of soaking in the degreaser bath followed by a rinse with hot water in the slop sink.

Rob P
05-04-2012, 05:49 PM
Excellant pictures and story going along Frank, you are excused from missing spring Robesonia. Looks like there will be no lack of information in the next newsletter.

bbettridge
05-04-2012, 08:11 PM
Nice Frank. I'm jealous! Always wanted to do the swap but sold it before I spent the $$ (a good idea actually)

Looks great though. Can't wait to see it.

Bill

Frank84
05-05-2012, 12:32 PM
Thanks Bill & Rob. Wish I could have made it to Robesonia but I had signed up for a Tough Mudder event for the same day about 6 months ago.

I'll keep posting things up as I make progress. This is really turning into more of a mechanical/structural restoration than a conversion. I didn't intend for that to happen but it did. I'll try to keep the thread picture heavy since I usually find that most interesting but if anyone wants more details on something let me know.

voodooEcon
05-06-2012, 05:39 AM
Looking good, Frank.

Make sure you take lots of before and after pictures when you get to actually swapping out the engine.

I'd also be interested to see what the inside of your old 3.9 looks like that this point too.

Also, where are the pictures of the new rear bumper?

Frank84
05-07-2012, 05:49 PM
Also, where are the pictures of the new rear bumper?

It's not on the car yet, still need to clean up a few things on the frame and body, find new hardware, and put one of the rear panels back on. But here are some quick shots.

It is all 3/16" steel except for the mounts which are 1/4". The finish is perfect and the welds are ground down smooth so it looks sharp. At almost half the price of a rovertym bumper it seems like a good deal, but it is definitely not for those that intend to drag their rear end over every rock at Rausch since it is not boxed nor does it wrap around to protect the sides much. I think it is a good match in strength and looks to my front ARB.

It mounts with the stock holes and then also uses existing holes that are in the frame horns in the rear - you don't cut them off like on the rovertym bumpers.

Also, this was my first order with Columbia Overland and they were FAST and the process was smooth. Shipping was only about $45 from Oregon which I thought was great compared with some other large-ish things I've ordered.

ini88
05-07-2012, 06:32 PM
The install kit I got included an EGR blanking kit. I later removed it and installed the threaded bung for the temperature probe.

Looking good! where did you get your temp sender for the EGR blanking kit? I need one and a EGR blanking plate for mine.

Frank84
05-08-2012, 07:17 AM
Looking good! where did you get your temp sender for the EGR blanking kit? I need one and a EGR blanking plate for mine.

The blanking plate came with the engine kit, and then i got the egr gage and sender from summit racing. Summit racing part # ATM-3344 which is Autometer part #3344. It came with the probe and bung to weld into the blanking plate and I think I remember needing a 9/16" drill bit to make the hole. Autometer also sells the gage without the probe and bung so be careful when buying it if you look on amazon or elsewhere.

Edit - just reread what you posted. Do you just need the sender? I didn't see those sold separately anywhere.

Frank84
05-10-2012, 05:46 PM
Body panel re-installed only this time with #8 sheet metal screws instead of rivets so it will be easy to remove next time. The other side was missing all the rivets so it got screws also. For some reason, the rivets fall out when you hit your car on trees.

Probably the most important part of the conversion is the diesel fuel only badge. I think this one is for a defender but it is actually made out of metal so I thought that was cool.

Frank84
05-10-2012, 05:52 PM
It had always perplexed me (and my passengers) why the PS front seat belt release button would get stuck down. I've never heard of anyone else with this issue, but I finally figured it out after 5 years. The metal part of the seat belt bracket lost some of its curve and the thing was getting pressed up against the seat hard enough to distort the plastic and prevent the button from releasing. Easy fix. Just remake the curve! Much better now.

Frank84
05-10-2012, 06:04 PM
Here's another fun one - non functioning power seats. This seems to be a common issue with RRC's at least. New switches are kind of expensive so you have nothing to lose by trying to bring your old ones back to life. My leaking sunroof (which is fixed now) used to pour water into my switches. Land Rover should have made them waterproof for these situations. Did you know these are actually Mercedes parts? At least they are stamped as such.

Taking them apart isn't too hard but you need to be aware that tiny springs and ball bearings will likely go flying if you aren't careful. I tried electronics cleaner first but that didn't budge the green corrosion. Some diluted muriatic acid, 5 minutes soaking time, and a brass bristled brush did excellent work however.

One of the plastic posts was snapped off as well that controls the reclining. I'm trying a bit of JB weld to see if that lasts. Fingers crossed...

Rob P
05-10-2012, 10:23 PM
Excellant work Frank. If the switches are just switches and nothing more than contacts, one could concievably just make their own switch panel to control the seats or pirate a junk yard car.

Frank84
05-11-2012, 08:54 AM
Excellant work Frank. If the switches are just switches and nothing more than contacts, one could concievably just make their own switch panel to control the seats or pirate a junk yard car.

Yeah, you definitely could just make your own switch panel. But you have to find a momentary switch rated for 30 amps. They're out there but not common.

Rob P
05-11-2012, 09:18 PM
Does the switch actually have 30 amps running through the contacts or does it just signal the window ECU to close the 30 amp relay?

Frank84
05-12-2012, 10:18 AM
Does the switch actually have 30 amps running through the contacts or does it just signal the window ECU to close the 30 amp relay?

I think it actually has 30 amps running through the switches. There was a write up somewhere online where someone found suitable switches and made their own replacement panel. If I can hunt that down I'll post up a link.

Frank84
05-12-2012, 11:16 AM
So, there's a reason why I've almost never heard of anyone installing an underdrive on a RRC/DI. Because they don't fit! I knew it wouldn't fit when I bought it, but I convinced myself it wouldn't be that hard to make it work.

The stock t-case barely fits which means there's negative 5 inches of room for the underdrive. In order to get it in there the trans tunnel needs to be extended back which is not a fun task. So far, I've only succeeded in making a mess of things (one of my strengths). I'm going to leave it like this for a while and make some new paneling after the drivetrain is in place and i'm sure no more cutting is needed.

crazyfish
05-12-2012, 11:39 AM
I'm glad you labeled the switch pictures "Before" and "After". ha

airbornrover
05-12-2012, 07:34 PM
Who cares? They're just passengers.:D

Frank84
05-13-2012, 11:41 AM
Who cares? They're just passengers.:D

haha - true!

Frank84
05-20-2012, 09:57 PM
Baby steps today on the rebuild. I installed the window motor I got from Lyle today which was very unrewarding because I have the wiring harness apart so I couldn't even test it out!

I also sort of fixed a dent that I made in my hood at Spruce Cabin last winter. It is far from perfect but you can hardly tell any more if you squint. At least it shouldn't rust.

Frank84
05-20-2012, 10:04 PM
I also made a mount so I could put my spare back in the original location. I've been driving around for 5 years with it taking up much of the trunk space and i've finally had it. There are instructions online for doing this (discoweb maybe?) if you search but they need a little modification if you are going to mount a 235/85. I'm pretty sure the instructions work with a 245/75 since we used them for my friend Chris' RRC a few years ago.

The gist of it is that seat belt needs to be remounted up as high as the roof of the car will allow and then you need some way of securing the tire - I went with the handy dandy ratchet strap.

Disco96JSWB
05-21-2012, 06:49 PM
That spare tire modification for the RRC looks great. I remember that issue.

Let's go back to the Underdrive, however. That's really cool. It looks like the Ashcroft unit that creates a 9:1 low-low (so to speak)? You'll be able to climb a tree with that gearing! It'll be worth the effort.

Frank84
05-21-2012, 08:23 PM
That spare tire modification for the RRC looks great. I remember that issue.

Let's go back to the Underdrive, however. That's really cool. It looks like the Ashcroft unit that creates a 9:1 low-low (so to speak)? You'll be able to climb a tree with that gearing! It'll be worth the effort.

I'm not sure how you and others drive the 5-speed's off road. My D90 with the 5-speed is no where near low enough (in my opinion) for crawling over all the rock beds at places like Rausch - especially with all the driveline slop in these things. I've loved the auto off road but I really like shifting myself the other 99% of the time I'm driving the car. This seemed like a great compromise since I really shouldn't have to slip the clutch going over stuff constantly. My guess is that the ~9:1 will be way lower than I need/want most of the time but it will nice to know it is there.

Even though Aschcroft doesn't have it on their website, they have recently made a version of the underdrive that will bolt straight up to the LT230's that are on US spec disco's without changing out intermediate gears and such. The trouble is that the floor pan isn't even close to working as you can see in my previous pictures. We'll see how it all turns out.

Rob P
05-21-2012, 10:35 PM
9:1 low range? Is this the Range Rover "Rubicon" edition? Or should we call it the "Ringwood" edition?

Frank84
05-31-2012, 06:21 PM
I don't generally work on this project during the week much, but since I'm falling behind my self imposed schedule I decided it was time to do some catch up work this week.

My front driveshaft does not get re-used so when I found it had a frozen u-joint I didn't care much. I then removed the rear and found that too had one frozen joint and the slip yoke also wouldn't move - WTF? Any idea what causes that to happen? Other than lack of maintenance on my part....oops....now I have a new joint in the rear and everything is well greased and ready to be installed again later this summer.

Next up it was time to start on the wiring. This is a nightmare on Classics. There are so many control boxes, relays, timers, etc and few still work 23 years later. I started by pulling the EFI harness (pictured) which really wasn't too bad. For converting to a Tdi, you can stop pulling wires there and start hooking up the Tdi harness in its place. Most people should simply do that and move on with their lives. But I'm a glutton for punishment I suppose because I decided to make an even bigger mess of things. The more I looked around at the wires in my truck, the more I found that were disconnected, cut, broke, etc. Next thing you know I have the dash removed in order to fix things and trace down some of my faults on the items I'd like to get working again. Removing the dash was easier than expected - though, putting it back is yet to be seen. I'm hoping that about a third of those wires seen in the pictures can be eliminated.

With the dash out, I'm going to remove the heater assembly so i can get good access to the bulkhead and apply some dynomat to keep a modicum of the diesel clatter down. I have no carpet so anything I can do to quiet it down will be useful.

Also, I took the opportunity to remove the non functioning remnants of my A/C system to fix something that Land Rover didn't fix until the last year of the Classics - the glove box! Not until 1995 did Land Rover put a proper glove box into the RRC. Making a glove box is not high on my "to do" list right now, but I have created the space to do it at a later date. All I'll need to do is add a door since the compartment is already there now that the evaporator is gone.

Last thing I did was to remove the Boge self leveling strut from the rear suspension. This is actually a kind of cool feature of these older Classics and 110's, but mine has a bad lower ball joint and I'm not even so sure it was capable of doing anything with my OME HD springs. It'll go on the shelf for now. As a bonus, my truck is now 18 pounds lighter which is probably more useful than the strut is with my 111hp engine getting installed.

Rob P
05-31-2012, 08:35 PM
Come on Frank, you can tell us, admit it, you are a closet Land Rover Mechanic

Frank84
06-01-2012, 06:33 AM
Come on Frank, you can tell us, admit it, you are a closet Land Rover Mechanic

I think you hit the nail on the head.

galen211
06-01-2012, 07:15 AM
I'm thinking this thread has taken him out of the closest so to speak.

Frank84
06-01-2012, 09:12 PM
I'm thinking this thread has taken him out of the closest so to speak.

haha - yeah, this has been my coming out I suppose. I've been in hiding for years.

Took off from work today and had an extra set of hands to help with the heavy stuff. Engine, trans, and steering box are out. Engine and trans are self explanatory for this project, but my steering box was leaking pretty bad so that got pulled too - access is so much better without an engine in the way! Any ideas on how to get that stupid drop arm off? I tried pullers, hammers, and then big hammers and nothing worked. I'm thinking about just buying an entirely new arm with a ball joint in it since I need the joint anyway - then I can get more creative with the removal.

The heater is out for access to the wiring behind it and also to figure out what to do about the vacuum solenoid. As best as i can tell, the flap that changes the system from "fresh air" to "recirculated air" to "air conditioning" is moved by a vacuum driven system that runs off the cruise control system believe it or not - maybe someone will correct me here but that is what it looks like to me. Overly complicated for sure. Well, I won't have cruise control any longer (not like it worked anyway) and there aren't any vacuum ports on my Tdi engine so I need another solution. I think I'm going to try to fix the flap in the "fresh air" position permanently and do away with the vacuum thing altogether.

Rob P
06-01-2012, 09:41 PM
If you have vacume driven accesories the diesel won't run them I'm sure. There must be some kinda vacuum generator available but I've not run across one. If you only have that one flap to operate how about hooking up a simple solid cable like a lawn mower throttle cable and hiding the lever up under the dash.

Do Dodge/Chevy/Ford diesels have vacuum assisted brakes? What do the 200TDI Discos do for power brakes?

Trevor
06-02-2012, 09:06 PM
Wow, Frank, that is quite the treatment you're giving the Strange Rover.

Frank84
06-03-2012, 07:40 AM
If you have vacume driven accesories the diesel won't run them I'm sure. There must be some kinda vacuum generator available but I've not run across one. If you only have that one flap to operate how about hooking up a simple solid cable like a lawn mower throttle cable and hiding the lever up under the dash.

Do Dodge/Chevy/Ford diesels have vacuum assisted brakes? What do the 200TDI Discos do for power brakes?

Any idea why diesels don't produce vacuum like petrol motors? It looks like the engine does have a "vacuum generator" that runs off the cam (?) to power the brakes. So, I could probably T into that or do what you said with a cable system. All of the other functions of the HVAC are cable actuated. Last night I simply unhooked the vacuum system from the heater and gravity took over and the flap stays in the "fresh air" position - I'm thinking I might just leave it like that. I'm not sure it is worth too much effort to try to regain the recirculated air position and I no longer have A/C so that is a moot point. I'll post up a few pictures later.

Frank84
06-03-2012, 07:42 AM
Wow, Frank, that is quite the treatment you're giving the Strange Rover.

Yeah, it has snowballed out of control really. I'm too far in to stop now though!

Frank84
06-03-2012, 08:41 AM
So here's what I learned about the overly complicated fresh/recirculate flap on the RRC heater. With the vacuum supply cut off, the flap will revert to the recirculated position due to a spring in the actuator. However, with the actuator arm removed from the flap, it will revert to the fresh air position thanks to gravity - I'm going to give this a try and hope it works. Getting access to the actuator again once things are assembled isn't too bad if I screw this one up - you just need to remove the panel under the steering wheel.

Rob P
06-03-2012, 09:46 PM
Frank as far as I know Diesel's have no butterfly plate on the intake creating no intake suction/vacuum. All Diesels may not be created equally though. BTW, Diesel is a man's name and should always be capitalized even though I don't always remember.

Frank84
06-04-2012, 06:52 AM
Frank as far as I know Diesel's have no butterfly plate on the intake creating no intake suction/vacuum. All Diesels may not be created equally though. BTW, Diesel is a man's name and should always be capitalized even though I don't always remember.

Good to know - thanks Rob. And I'll work on my capitalization...

sven
06-04-2012, 09:03 AM
Cool project. I remember this truck loosing its brakes when we drove into Renovo from Bill Simones cabin. Brake fluid was boiling?

So where did you source the TDI engine from?

Frank84
06-04-2012, 12:45 PM
Cool project. I remember this truck loosing its brakes when we drove into Renovo from Bill Simones cabin. Brake fluid was boiling?

So where did you source the TDI engine from?

Yeah, I boiled the brake fluid - driver error. I should have gone into low range I guess to avoid using the brakes on that long decent. And on the way home the next day I lost a trans cooler line which was not fun to fix on the side of the road - luckily Dana and Jill came along and helped me patch things up.

I got the engine, R380, and "install kit" from Jim at Red Hawk Rovers in Colorado. Jim is currently in Afghanistan so I'm not sure how/if the business is running at the moment, but he is still very responsive to emails and has been a big help getting the project started and keeping it moving along. I know I got the last Tdi set up he had but he said he intends to bring in more in the future.

Frank84
06-04-2012, 05:19 PM
I coaxed my friend into bringing his power washer over to get things all cleaned up for rust repair and some new undercoating. That power washer really worked great! I couldn't believe how easily it stripped the mud and grease off.

Frank84
06-05-2012, 06:44 PM
My steering box was the leakiest part of the car and it was the only component that actually left a puddle wherever I parked. In addition to that it felt like I was the captain of a ship with all the play. So, I bought a rebuilt steering box from Meridian to solve these problems. I thought about trying to rebuild it myself but I don't need anything else to slow me down right now so it was the credit card to the rescue.

I really don't understand how you're supposed to remove the drop arm while the box is in the car. Mine was on so tight that a puller was useless. I'm sure heat would help but you'd ruin the seals (assuming you're only trying to replace the arm). Since everything was off the car, I propped it all up in the press and gave it a go that way. It worked, but I've never pulled this hard before on the lever - I was about to give up because I was bending the press frame and all of a sudden BANG - it came off!

Frank84
06-10-2012, 06:50 PM
Got some work done this weekend. Replaced the body mount bushings and cleaned up the mounts a bit. Surprisingly, all of the bolts came right out without a fight.

I also added some extra material to the bottom of the hitch to give it some extra strength. Mine was starting to collapse on itself a little from hitting too many rocks.

Frank84
06-10-2012, 06:53 PM
...also got my new bumper installed

Disco96JSWB
06-10-2012, 09:04 PM
I also added some extra material to the bottom of the hitch to give it some extra strength. Mine was starting to collapse on itself a little from hitting too many rocks.

Very good idea! You are really moving along with the project. The rear bumper looks good too.

Trevor
06-10-2012, 09:36 PM
I like the bumper. The design isn't ringing any bells, who made it?

Trevor
06-10-2012, 09:39 PM
Sorry, I went back over the thread and you already answered my question.

redhawkrovers
06-11-2012, 11:44 AM
Frank looks good. The web site is down till I return home.
I will be bringing a container with engine kits, defender body parts,lot's of new parts
next April-May time frame, I'm also looking into having 100 inch fiberglass defender 2 door
body's made to mount an classic-disco1 frames with a soft top.
They would be rubber mounted like the disco. Any thought's on this?
Love the color same red as my disco, do you know if the Classic steering column would fit a disco?
I want to get rid of the air bag steering wheel.
Keep up the good work.
Jim

Frank84
06-11-2012, 12:15 PM
Frank looks good. The web site is down till I return home.
I will be bringing a container with engine kits, defender body parts,lot's of new parts
next April-May time frame, I'm also looking into having 100 inch fiberglass defender 2 door
body's made to mount an classic-disco1 frames with a soft top.
They would be rubber mounted like the disco. Any thought's on this?
Love the color same red as my disco, do you know if the Classic steering column would fit a disco?
I want to get rid of the air bag steering wheel.
Keep up the good work.
Jim

Great news on the new shipment! I'm not in the market for a second engine yet, but maybe some day if my D90's V8 dies....

Is the 100" defender body thing something that you came up with or is that an existing item that's you'd be importing? Sounds like a really good idea, especially for someone like myself that has a range rover body that is slowly rotting away (though, I'm fixing that). There are tons of RRC's with rusty body's but good frames so I'm sure there would be a market - though, limited in numbers. I think the success of the "kit" would be determined by how complete it is.

I'm not 100% sure on the steering column, but my gut is that it is not a direct swap. The bulkheads are different enough that I don't think it would be a straight foward change. The pedal box is completely different in the area that the steering column goes through. However, I think you could just take a RRC steering wheel and mount that on your column - pretty sure the splines match. I can take pictures of mine if you want. The exception to all this is that a '95 RRC has a disco steering column but it too has airbags.

redhawkrovers
06-11-2012, 12:19 PM
Frank your going to halve to come out to Colorado next year
with Strange Rover and go an a expedition trip in Co.and Utah
that I will be putting on for customer's and friends.
it will be 9 or 10 vehicles.
Jim

Frank84
06-11-2012, 01:33 PM
Frank your going to halve to come out to Colorado next year
with Strange Rover and go an a expedition trip in Co.and Utah
that I will be putting on for customer's and friends.
it will be 9 or 10 vehicles.
Jim

That sounds like fun! I'd seriously consider that. I'm heading out to Colorado and Utah in October, but won't be getting on too many trails - mostly touring national parks.

redhawkrovers
06-11-2012, 02:57 PM
Frank this is something I've been thinking about building or have built.
My thought's are build the body tub out of fiberglass and use a steel
bulkhead or glass not sure. glass half door's metal windshield frame
glass front end and or optional tube and sheet metal front end
like the comp style in the UK. with a soft top. and roll cage.
would like it to use as much as much from the disco as possible.
Jim

Frank84
06-17-2012, 01:21 PM
Made some progress this week but taking today off for father's day festivities and a mental health break.

Perhaps the hardest part of converting a Pre-'95 RRC to a manual trans is the pedal box. Unless you can find an uber rare RRC pedal box for a 5-speed you'll likely be doing something like what I did. Took me about 12 hours to get things to play nice together but it looks like it should work. The disco box came with my diesel so this really didn't cost me anything other than time - though, I watched movies whiling doing this so it wasn't too bad.

I'm sure there are a bunch of ways to do this, but this is what I did:

1. Shrink disco clutch/brake pedal bracket down so it is just a single clutch bracket. Trim/adjust/re-adjust so that it fits the RRC pedal box and the clutch master cylinder rod is straight when assembled. Make sure all the factory springs will fit and install still. It also has to clear the dashboard support structure and slip through the hole in the bulkhead to install. Easier said than done but when you get there, weld in position.

2. Remove RRC brake pedal pad/plate and replace with Disco pedal/plate. I used my D90 and disco box to get the left to right measurements for proximity to the gas pedal. The smaller pedal isn't 100% necessary but it will make it much less likely that you'll hit two pedals at the same time.

3. Bend and then lengthen (b/c it is now bent) the clutch pedal arm to bring it about 2" to the right to position it ergonomically in the footwell. Once again, I used the disco and D90 to get the 2" measurement. If you leave the clutch arm straight like it came off the disco box it will be too far left - it will function if you remove the foot rest pad (dead pedal) but feels weird.

I also got the main wiring harness labeled and removed. Gives me access for fixing up some of the rust, putting dynomat on the bulkhead, and removing the wires from many of the defunct systems on the Strange Rover, of which there are many.

redhawkrovers
06-17-2012, 02:36 PM
Great job on pedal box!
The Disco's are much easier.
Jim

Frank84
06-18-2012, 07:13 AM
Great job on pedal box!
The Disco's are much easier.
Jim

Yeah, it made me wish I had started with a discovery!

rijosho
06-18-2012, 02:08 PM
Are you re-wiring any lights? I may need to re-do a few lights in the back due to some corrosion in the lines, and was wondering where you sourced and what size if so.

Frank84
06-18-2012, 04:24 PM
Are you re-wiring any lights? I may need to re-do a few lights in the back due to some corrosion in the lines, and was wondering where you sourced and what size if so.

I didn't rewire any lights specifically though I am rewiring a bunch of things. My local Napa and "mom & pop" autoparts stores come up short for electrical stuff. However, I've found Autozone has a good selection of wire, connectors, relays, etc for most simple tasks. Just take a piece of the wire you want to replace and match it up at the store - you can always go to a thicker gage without worry. I know some people insist on soldeiring wires but i have found it much easier to use the crimp on connectors and splicers - get the "weather proof" ones which have built in heat shrink and hit them with a heat gun afterward.

However, if you have corrosion in the connectors give this a shot before trying to track down replacements. I have a spray bottle of POR-15's "Metal Ready" which smells like diluted muriatic acid to me - can be bought at any pool supply place. I just spray the metal ready into the connector, let it soak for a minute, rinse it good with water, blow it dry, and you're good to go. I had a bunch of connectors covered in green corrosion and this takes care of it effortlessly. It isn't good for your skin especially if you have any cuts...

If they are too far gone and need to be replaced, AB and RN have a bunch of the connectors with pigtails but you may have to call because they can be tough to find navigating their websites. I know RN has the defender tail light parts all available individually but you need to call.

rijosho
06-19-2012, 08:31 AM
Thanks for the suggestions. I had bought the pigtail replacement parts with about 8" of surplus wires a few months back - I should just bring those with me when trying to match up the wires - forgot about those! I have the epoxy lined heat shrink stuff and the epoxy line butt connectors that I was going to use for the project. No lights in the back is no good - I've been having to time my drives so that I'm back before dark!

crazyfish
06-19-2012, 03:19 PM
Nice work. If you keep this up it will be worth twice what you paid! ha

Frank84
06-19-2012, 04:05 PM
Nice work. If you keep this up it will be worth twice what you paid! ha

haha - that's only if I fill the tank before selling it...

Frank84
06-26-2012, 08:39 PM
I finished replacing the rear ball joint (from Atlantic British) and all of the suspension bushings with genuine parts kits from Rovers North. I'm glad I ordered their kit because it includes new nuts and bolts which came in handy as I had to destroy a few of mine to get the arms out. I had thought about the poly bushes but it seems like some people like them and others hate them. I never heard complaints about the originals so I figured I'd stay safe since this is not a job you want to do twice.

The largest PITA was definitely the A-arm with the stupid ball joint. That thing wanted a fight and it got it! I won in the end but I had a few moments that I wanted to throw in the towel. The joint was in horrible shape and clunked around quite a bit but most of the other bushings showed wear, but nothing completely horrible.

Pictures of bushings aren't too exciting but I included a few just because I had them.

At this point, I'm nearly 2 months into my "Diesel Install" and my engine hasn't even left the stand yet ... I guess I'm easily side tracked.

Rob P
06-29-2012, 05:31 PM
looking good Frank.

Frank84
07-02-2012, 11:05 AM
Had some time last friday and got the stainless brake hoses installed from AB which I found a deal on a few months back. They are 2" longer than stock and I ended up re-using the factory plastic coiled guard thingy. I figure it might give a little protection from something like tire chains rubbing on the lines. Plus, I think it looks cool.

I'm not sure how much more the diesel weighs than the petrol motor, but it is a bit heavier so I added a 3/8" spacer up front from the rear of a disco. This really is just a bandaid and I'm just being cheap because I really should get HD springs, especially with the bumper and winch. I'll see how everything sits when I'm done and evaluate it I suppose.

Also, I think I'm about done "rust proofing" it for now. The entire underside is coated with Eastwood's "heavy duty anti rust" and the internals of the frame, pillars, rockers, etc is coated with their green colored "Internal Frame Coating". The anti rust is kind of sticky/waxy feeling and I'm not sure it was the best choice because it might just hold onto the mud. However, I was kind of impressed with the internal stuff because it came with a 2 foot hose with a special nozzle to get inside everywhere - worked way better than I would have thought.

Disco96JSWB
07-02-2012, 12:05 PM
I used that Eastwood internal chassis section paint on the bulkhead and chassis of my Series project and was also impressed. The plastic hose and the 'all directions' nozzle worked well.

redhawkrovers
07-02-2012, 02:15 PM
Frank
When you get new springs
go with RTE 2 inch and a 3 inch longer shock
I went with there 3.5 spring and 4 inch longer pro-comps
and have been impressed with the ride and handling and i left
the front sway bar off, i got almost 5 inches of lift from saggy stock
it settled at around 4 or so and had no change in front end hight
after i put the Diesel in.
I should have used a 5 inch shock they flex very well.
Jim

Frank84
07-02-2012, 04:58 PM
Frank
When you get new springs
go with RTE 2 inch and a 3 inch longer shock
I went with there 3.5 spring and 4 inch longer pro-comps
and have been impressed with the ride and handling and i left
the front sway bar off, i got almost 5 inches of lift from saggy stock
it settled at around 4 or so and had no change in front end hight
after i put the Diesel in.
I should have used a 5 inch shock they flex very well.
Jim

Thanks for the tip Jim - I hadn't even thought about RTE since I've just gotten used to always ordering OME stuff. Did you need cones, bump stops, or things like that? I probably won't get around to swapping springs for a bit - I need to actually get this thing on the road first!

Disco96JSWB
07-02-2012, 08:58 PM
My experience is that the 3" OME shock (N25 and I believe it cross-references to a Nissan Patrol) is too long with stock bump stops. Fully-compressed and with the rear locker engaged, the shock broke. I now have OME Nitrocharger long-travel shocks in the rear and the ride is pretty rough. I wish I'd just gone with the old-style OME shock.

redhawkrovers
07-03-2012, 05:38 AM
I didn't get a chance to flex it to the max before I
left for Afghanistan. But I will be using some daystar bump stop's
when I get back and will see if I need cone's.
I think the biggest problem with shock's breaking is the factory
angle's another thing i will be looking at when I get back.
I've got a lot of work to do to it when I get back may need help
to have it ready for the May trips, suspension, finish the wiring,
over/underdrive install,toyota rear end front gear's,new CV joints
Front drive shaft,Charge the A/C, install the longer brake lines
Frank want to come out to Colorado next April?:)

Trevor
07-03-2012, 06:52 AM
I broke an N25 as well. I also felt that the N25's were too soft for my RRC.

I converted the rears to eyelet to eyelet shocks and used Doetsch 8000 shocks. IIRC, they have 10" or 11" of travel. I can try to find the product number if you're interested. The ride feels much better to me. I haven't had the chance to test them off road very much yet.

Frank84
07-03-2012, 11:59 AM
So many suspension choices out there. For now, my plan is to stay semi-stock with nothing more than a 1- 2" lift so i don't have to get into cones/bumpstops/retainers/cranked radius arms/longer brake lines/etc. Doing all that would lead to needing bigger tire, gears, axles, etc. A very slippery, expensive slope!

Frank84
07-03-2012, 07:51 PM
I think I'm finally over the hump and I'm starting to install stuff back on the car for a change! New front brakes, pedals/master/booster, new lower steering column u-joint, and the rebuilt steering box.

redhawkrovers
07-06-2012, 02:54 PM
Looking good you are going to mess up that nice frame paint though
when you cut off the old motor mounts and weld the new ones in
they will be behind the V8 ones about an inch or so. wish I had all the photo's
I took when doing mine some how got deleted from my camera.

Frank84
07-07-2012, 03:06 PM
Looking good you are going to mess up that nice frame paint though
when you cut off the old motor mounts and weld the new ones in
they will be behind the V8 ones about an inch or so. wish I had all the photo's
I took when doing mine some how got deleted from my camera.

I'll post a better update later with some pictures - I'm just taking a late lunch break now. But the engine mounts are in place, and I re-painted the frame after removing a lot of my nice, new paint to weld the new mounts in. The engine really fits like a glove - nearly perfect. The valve cover was a bit tight with the bulkhead but a large hammer fixed that.

Frank84
07-07-2012, 09:58 PM
The engine mounts ended up being back and down a little. You can see where the old ones were cut out. I also had to do a little more trimming to get the shift mechanism for the underdrive in place in the trans tunnel - should be fun to try to seal that all up again.

Still lots left to do on this project before it is on the road, but hopefully I can get the engine running "soon" just to see how things work in the driveway.

redhawkrovers
07-08-2012, 10:48 AM
Frank all the classic's i've seen with the 300
seem tight at the firewall for covering up the floor make cardbard patterns
then take them to a sheet metal shop to have bent out
a heating A/C shop can do this also.

Trevor
07-08-2012, 12:02 PM
Looking good, Frank. How long until you fire it up for a test drive in the driveway?

Frank84
07-08-2012, 06:54 PM
Good idea on the HVAC/sheet metal shop Jim. I'll look around for one in my area. I'd like it to look somewhat decent so that may be the way to go.

So, I hot wired it and fired it up today and it ran great! It started up so fast and easy that I jumped when it burst to life - I was not expecting it to start up without at least a little fight. It was as if I had just turned it off to run in to get a quart of milk at the store and came back out and re-started it. I let it run for a half hour and it doesn't even leak yet! (yes, the fluids are full)

I have to make the clutch line and bleed the brakes so hopefully i can test it out in the driveway later this week if those things go okay. Still tons to do before I can even think about taking it down the road, but I'm getting closer!

redhawkrovers
07-09-2012, 03:52 AM
That what I love about these engines and of course that little bit of diesel clatter:o
You will have to post a vidio of it running

Frank84
07-18-2012, 05:04 PM
Got a little done this past weekend. LT230 lever is hooked up and I spent a while trying to figure out the best way to hook up the underdrive. I originally planned to use the stock RRC borg warner shifter but it wouldn't have been a very clean install. The solid rod linkage physically hooked up but it didn't allow for any great mounting locations. Luckily, I also had the original tcase shifter off my dad's DII laying around (had been upgraded to a DI shifter). Actually, the cable was still laying on top of the tcase and has been driving around without a purpose for the last decade or so. This hooked up very nicely without really modifying anything other than some holes in the trans tunnel to mount it. A slightly shorter cable would have been nice but this one works.

Also started on the wiring. There are a bunch of things to rewire when going from the V8/auto/borg warner to the Tdi/R380/LT230. I'm trying to do it as cleanly as possible so having it inside the basement makes that easy. Luckily, Jim provided the wiring harness from the donor vehicle so this is as near to plug and play as it gets. I had a lot of defunct electrical system on my car (very unusual on a rover), so I'm either fixing the ones I really want to keep or completely removing all traces of the ones I don't care about ever seeing again. I have a few new gauges to add into the mix so I'll try to integrate those into the loom as well so things work like I want.

rijosho
07-18-2012, 06:11 PM
That last photo just gave me anxiety.

Frank84
07-18-2012, 07:18 PM
That last photo just gave me anxiety.

It actually looks much worse in person. And I think i did have an anxiety attack after about 4 hours of staring at it with the diagrams and not making a whole lot of sense out it. After a few beers I calmed down and it all started to make sense.

redhawkrovers
07-19-2012, 07:04 AM
Frank
When I wired my disco I had the dash out but left the harness inplace.I think it might be better with it out on the bench like your doing it. I got rid of the air bags,ABS and repaired a burnt wire wile I was in there.
and ran some bundled wires for gages I used 4 wires in a sleave with a shield from Radio shack I ran two
sleaves of it one to the A piller and the other to the vent in the top of the dash I have a generic 3 gage pod for the top of the dash that fits well 12 bucks on e bay wish some one made a piller mount gage pod for the rovers. I still need to install the gages when I get back.
Jim

galen211
07-19-2012, 07:08 AM
That last photo just gave me anxiety.

Ha. That was my first thought too.

Frank84
07-19-2012, 08:39 AM
wish some one made a piller mount gage pod for the rovers

Me too - that would be the ideal spot. However I think it is going to be easiest and cleanest for my situation to just put them in my center console area since I have to do a lot of fab there anyway.

Frank84
07-30-2012, 06:44 PM
New tires are mounted/balanced. I decided to give the General Grabbers a try since they were $30/tire cheaper than the BFG AT's. Similar tread so should do okay for me. I thought about getting another set of "mud" tires but I was tired of the noise on the highway and I intend to actually drive this car a lot more often now after doing all this work. Hopefully I don't regret the decision.

I've made mucho progress on the wiring harness and chopped out a ton of it as you can see in the one picture. I had a few heart attacks and nervous breakdowns along the way trying to figure the mess out but I finally have it all ready to go. Everything that isn't needed is gone and everything that is has a label for reassembly and trouble shooting (bound to have screwed up something). Some wires will need to be run after the harness is back in the car because I don't know how long to make them but I know where everything needs to get to. I think the most surprising and confusing part was how thoroughly integrated the cruise control and A/C was with the rest of the car. It seemed like every time I picked up a wire it ended up being somehow related to one of those two systems.

At this point the rangie is actually running and driving but far from road legal. No exhaust, wiring, seats, dash, front shocks, floor, etc. However, I sat on some cushions and took it for a quick spin and everything seems to be working right now so that is a major relief.

grnthng
07-31-2012, 12:00 AM
Wow, Hi Frank! It's been a while since i've been on here....but I see you have been busy! You went in deep, holy moly!
That means the Strange Rover will be a around a while longer! Looking foward to finishing up on mine as well so we can get back up to Ringwood!
I regret not coming around more often....I just went through all the pics, I'll have to catch up on all the reading though!

Frank84
07-31-2012, 10:45 AM
Wow, Hi Frank! It's been a while since i've been on here....but I see you have been busy! You went in deep, holy moly!
That means the Strange Rover will be a around a while longer! Looking foward to finishing up on mine as well so we can get back up to Ringwood!
I regret not coming around more often....I just went through all the pics, I'll have to catch up on all the reading though!

Yeah, it was all or none on this truck. I was looking for a project so I decided to go for it. Though, it ended up being about 3x the amount of work that I was expecting.

I'm hoping to have another Ringwood clean up in November, but right now I'm a bit busy and the trails are CLOSED to motor vehicle access (even with our permit) for an "environmental study". They've been closed since mid April with no estimate if/when they'll open again.

redhawkrovers
07-31-2012, 02:17 PM
Wow Frank
What a pile of wiring ! Always looks bad when you have all the covering off of it.
I found a solution to gauges look at www.speedhut.com
they have 4 in one and 2 in one gauges and they are made in Utah and will put custom logo's
on them. Your under drive shifter gave me a new product idea.
Twin stick shifters and triple stick shifters for use with the under or overdrive units.
most likely be cable shifted so the shifters could be body mounted.
I'm also working on a NV4500 to the LT230 Adapter. No one makes one for resale
Advance Adapters made a adapter to mate the nv4500 to the International version
of the 300 Tdi so if they make it still it would bolt on the 300.
Internet is a wonderful tool to use from over here.
I've enjoyed your progress makes the down time more fun
Thanks
Jim

Frank84
07-31-2012, 06:37 PM
Those gauges look real nice Jim but I already bought some auto gauges from amazon so I'll probably stick with those for now. I'm keeping the stock gauges and just adding exhaust temp, oil pressure, and volts. Maybe more in the future if I need a project.

"twin stick" shifters would be sweet, though you could do a triple shifter for use with the CDL perhaps.

Sounds like the internet is keeping you busy and your mind on some cool future products/projects! How much more time do you have left over there?

redhawkrovers
08-01-2012, 05:43 AM
I have till mid April.
I wish i would have found that gauge co. before I bought mine also.

Frank84
08-06-2012, 09:23 PM
Got my exhaust made up and installed this weekend. I ended up making it from a conglomeration of parts but I'm happy with the results.

The down pipe came from Jim with the Tdi, the muffler is a "Raptor" turbo muffler that I think Jim recommended to me a while back, the "ball and socket" connectors and hangers are from Jegs, the hoop part of the pipe that goes over the axle was bought used for $20 on this forum a while back, and then there is a 45* bend and straight section from the local parts store.

I'm fairly certain it took longer to figure out how to piece it all together than to actually do it. And after all that work I just had to paint it with some high temp paint I had sitting around. I just couldn't bare to have it start rusting before I really even got to drive the truck. Silly, perhaps, but I had to do it.

redhawkrovers
08-07-2012, 12:25 PM
Nice exhaust work Frank, really like the ball and socket connections
As much as that engine torques that will make it last longer.
I'll be using them for now on. Can't wait to see it some day.
Jim

redhawkrovers
08-15-2012, 03:32 PM
Frank
Any update's ?

Frank84
08-15-2012, 06:38 PM
Frank
Any update's ?

You bet! But the pictures are kind of boring and just show my current state of the wiring mess.

Basically, i have the wiring loom in the car and I have tested everything reasonably possible without reassembling the entire interior. I just came in from outside (started to rain) and I have all the wiring under the hood much neater than in the pictures since they're now in those plastic sleeves and run more carefully. But inside the car looks the same still - project for this weekend.

I ended up with a handful of minor electrical issues that I sorted through, but there are currently 3 that I haven't solved yet.

#1: Dummy light for oil pressure isn't working at all. Bulb is okay. It used to come on when the ignition was moved to position two and then it would extinguish once the engine started. Now, it doesn't come on at all. This is still the stock V8 wiring but it hooked straight up to the Tdi pressure switch without modification. Not a big deal since I have the gauge now which does work. Is about 40 PSI good for these engines? I'm going to have a look at the wiring diagrams again, because I removed the "low oil level logic unit" which I thought only controlled the light for low oil level (not pressure) but I could have goofed up. The Classics have a oil level sensor in the pan on the V8's.

#2 & #3: I feel silly even mentioning these two, especially since neither worked on my car previously. But the low coolant light stays on and flashes constantly - bulb removed for now. Switch is good and I do actually have coolant in it. Low washer light doesn't work. I have no washer fluid and the light doesn't illuminate - switch is good once again. These two things are obviously not important, but I'm just being anal after doing all this work on it. Time to trace some wires.

Frank84
08-15-2012, 06:48 PM
.....also.....

I got a new 1987/88 Classic diff lock light - this thing is almost bright enough to use as a flashlight! And I ended up using the original "check engine" light as my glow plug light. Unlike previously, my check engine light now extinguishes after 8 seconds...

The factory inertia switch is hooked up as well to the fuel cut off so I will now have at least one "safety" feature in the car other than seat belts!

Plus, I ended up making a small loom for the extra gauges and ran the lights for them through the old harness for the auto trans shifter light bulb harness so they'll dim with the dimmer switch.

redhawkrovers
08-16-2012, 12:10 AM
40 psi is good
At least your not using your A/C, mine doesn't work ran out of time
to figure it out, the electric fans come on after the engine is started
and then won't shut off till I unplug the relay.
I moved 5 relay's under the hood from inside when I did mine.
I still have some little things to work out also.
That's a lot of time to put in making everything work but it's worth it.
Keep up the good work you will be done soon !!
Jim

Frank84
08-16-2012, 08:25 PM
I decided to take it for a spin again since it is more road worthy than last time I had it out now that I have some electrical stuff. Good and bad. Good news is I drove about ~3 miles without breaking down. Bad news is it seemed to be on the verge of doing so. Now that I have a temperature gauge again I can monitor that thing. Once I got out on the road and went up a hill it nearly shot to the red. I babied it back home. At first glance, I don't see anything really wrong but the only thing that stands out to me is that the radiator itself doesn't seem to be very hot. It is warm, but not hot like you'd think it would be if the car was really over heating.

So, I'm guess there are a bunch of things that could be the cause.

1. Bad thermostat (but it is new).

2. Bad water pump (but it is new).

3. Blocked radiator (but it is newly recored).

4. Temp gauge doesn't work with the diesel properly so is mis-reading the temperature as being higher than it actually is. Maybe I need a different temp sender unit or something.

5. Something else? Probably a bunch of other possibilities.

Any ideas on where to start first in tracking down the issue?

EDIT: Checked for air in the system and it seemed okay so I don't think that is the issue.

redhawkrovers
08-17-2012, 03:27 AM
Most likly an air bubble take the plasic plug out from behind the thermastat housing and fill with coolant.
They tend to get air locked here. Also try your v8 sender
hope that helps.
Jim

Frank84
08-17-2012, 07:34 AM
Most likly an air bubble take the plasic plug out from behind the thermastat housing and fill with coolant.
They tend to get air locked here. Also try your v8 sender
hope that helps.
Jim

Thanks Jim, I'll give those two things a shot tonight. The V8 sender just screws into the Tdi?

redhawkrovers
08-18-2012, 04:08 AM
Thanks Jim, I'll give those two things a shot tonight. The V8 sender just screws into the Tdi?

Yes it does at the front of the engine

Frank84
08-23-2012, 07:17 PM
So I have my "over heating" issue mostly figured out. Turns out it is not over heating but the issue is that the Disco sender doesn't talk with the gauge the same way the RRC sender did. The resistance must be a little different in the two units so my gauge sits just a little under the red zone yet is still a cool 190* as confirmed with a rigged up autometer gauge.

Unfortunately, the two senders are not interchangeable and are different sizes as you can see in the picture. I may drill/tap the brass plug on the top of the t-stat housing for the RRC sender, but this is not a priority and I'll get to it "later" since it is usable as-is for the moment.

Since it literally takes under 1 minute to remove the t-stat (including finding the right socket), I decided to pull it and check it in the kitchen. I compared the new one I installed (on the right) with the old one (on the left). Both worked, but the old one opened at 192* and the new one opened at 198*. Also, the old one opened about a 1/3 further by the time I was at about 203*. Having said all of that, I think the thermometer wasn't super accurate because the water was at a roaring boil at 208*. No earth shattering revelations here except that the t-stat is not an issue.

Frank84
08-23-2012, 07:36 PM
I also am about 95% done with the wiring. It still looks messy inside because the wires have nothing to route under or hook up to for the most part. As the interior gets installed it will look much better. The main loom is run through the largest size plastic sheathing stuff I could find at the auto parts store and it just barely fit. Under the hood is pretty much cleaned up too and there are simply a lot less wires and relays in general. And most importantly, no ECU's!

I still have to clean up a messy aftermarket radio install and I'll need to extend the power seat wires on the driver's side - need to relocate the fuses and relays somewhere more water resistant than under the seat. But it is otherwise mostly buttoned up electrically.

All of the electrical stuff I was able to remove weighed in at 15 pounds! I figure that must be good for a few MPG's...

Frank84
08-23-2012, 07:50 PM
And last update post for today...

The previously installed rear OME shocks had the washers put on reversed on both sides which ended up ruining the bushings on the passenger side. On the driver's side, when I went to correct it and remove the nut on the bottom of the shock the damn stud that goes through the axle bracket snapped. I suppose that is par for the course with this truck.

Now I have new, softer valved OME shocks out back as well as "borrowed" OME medium duty rear springs from Jeremy. My old OME heavy duty rear springs were actually shorter than the medium ones but the wire diameter was thicker. I also added a disco spring isolator to the top since they are cheap and will get me a 1/4" lift for next to nothing. I should have measured the height before and after but it is damn close by eye. I'm after a Cadillac ride with my rangie and the firm shocks and heavy duty springs just weren't providing me with that. We'll see how this setup works out.

For extra gauges, I ordered a cheap set of autometer ones that included engine temp, oil pressure, and volts. I also got a pyrometer for the exhaust. I didn't see the need for a second engine temp gauge (though, I may prove myself wrong...) so I figured I'd remove that from the three gauge set and try to get the larger pyrometer gauge into the smaller opening. It ended up just working out but now I have to figure out where to mount this inside the truck once things are re-assembled.

redhawkrovers
08-24-2012, 07:06 AM
Frank you might be able to put the sender in the cyl head about half way back on the drivers side
there is a non used sender or a plug I think it's the same size thread /hole as your V8 sender.
I like that you used the classic air box I may switch to one it would work well with my snorkel.
Jim

Frank84
08-24-2012, 09:16 AM
Frank you might be able to put the sender in the cyl head about half way back on the drivers side
there is a non used sender or a plug I think it's the same size thread /hole as your V8 sender.
I like that you used the classic air box I may switch to one it would work well with my snorkel.
Jim

Good idea on that plug - I'll take a look at it and that could be a simple solution. However, is that plug going into the exhaust port in the head? I thought I remembered reading a little on it and it had something to do with the EGR system so I had assumed it was measuring exhaust gases or something. I'll check.

Reusing the Classic air box isn't a straight bolt on but the mods weren't too bad. I decided to reuse it simply because I like the metal housing versus the plastic disco one (same reason I reused the Classic expansion tank). Also, all of the brackets on the inner fenders were set up for the Classic one obviously, not the disco one so I actually think this was the easiest route for me.

Attached are some pictures to help out if you ever want to do this install on the cheap during a conversion. I left the mounting brackets on the housing alone but removed a few inches of the housing including all of the clips and stuff that attached the old MAF sensor. I found that the V8 y-pipe had a short section with 2 different diameters which happened to be PERFECT for an adapter to mate the Classic housing with the Disco intake tube. Weld the adapter on and everything falls right into place when you bolt it up.

redhawkrovers
08-25-2012, 03:22 PM
That sensor go's into a coolant passage
also the rear heater hose rout's behind the cyl head.
Your doing great work. Want a job in Colorado next year ?
Jim

Frank84
08-30-2012, 07:44 PM
That sensor go's into a coolant passage
also the rear heater hose rout's behind the cyl head.
Your doing great work. Want a job in Colorado next year ?
Jim

Hmmm...i do like Colorado but I don't think i could leave beautiful NJ.

I haven't actually tried swapping in the sender yet, but I will get to that "soon", though not this weekend because I'm taking a break and going away. I have gotten a few other things fixed up though and I'll post that in a few minutes.

The heater hoses in the picture are actually not hooked up to the heater yet since the heater is still in my basement. They're just connected together with an fitting so that is why they are in a funny place. The heater comes through the firewall in a different place on the RRC than a disco or '95 RRC so they may still look slightly different when i'm done anyway.

Frank84
08-30-2012, 08:59 PM
Made some progress on the interior for a change. Took me a little while but it ended up not being too hard to fabricate new paneling for the transmission tunnel and make it removable for repairs. Two separate panels worked out much easier and the larger one can be removed without taking the seats out, but the small one needs the driver's seat removed. Lots of screws helped get things too seal up tight on the uneven surfaces. The large panel in the rear load space is also removable now too, though, there are a lot of screws for that one so I likely won't have it out often.

A coat of bed liner on the interior got rid of the nasty look to the floor. I was cheap, as usual with the Strange Rover, and did it myself with a brush. It didn't turn out too bad actually, though I'd only recommend doing it this way for a similar application where floor mats and seats will cover much of it. A professional spray job looks better.

I have long legs and decided to extend the mounting brackets for the seat back 2.5 inches so my right leg doesn't cramp up and rub the steering wheel when I'm driving. I just used some angle iron I had sitting around and two M8x1.25 nuts that I picked up. I drove it for about 10 minutes afterward and what a difference this makes - highly recommend this cheap mod for anyone with my same problem. The old mounting points still work too so it can easily be put back.

Along with a few other parts, Randy sent me 6 DII tie downs that I mounted in the rear. I had previously bought other tie downs but they looked like they'd definitely rattle like crazy. The factory DII ones won't.

Frank84
09-09-2012, 07:37 PM
Got my dash board back in the car and made it out to the picnic and Rausch this weekend. Biggest thing left to do is make a center console. Probably a dozen or so odds and end items to finish up and fix after its maiden voyage this past weekend. Some rattles and clunks will need diagnosing but nothing serious.

Overall, I'm really impressed with this little motor. I put over 300 miles on it with a mix of highway, back roads, and fourwheeling. I can't believe 2.5L and 110 HP can pull a range rover but it does! Not fast, but it can keep up with traffic at 70-75 all day long - just don't hit a big hill without momentum. I got 26.7 mpg on the ride out there which was mostly highway but I'm still thrilled with that. I'm pretty sure it could even do better than that once I learn to drive it a little smoother. I've got 32" tires and stock gears which isn't helping acceleration one bit so that will need fixing in the future - got to leave something to do next year.

Disco96JSWB
09-10-2012, 10:27 AM
Fascinating to read about the trip, Frank. You demonstrated some courage in making a 300-mile shake-down run. A lot of people tend to use a 3-mile radius for initial 'de-bugging' drives.

Jeremy

Frank84
09-10-2012, 03:56 PM
Fascinating to read about the trip, Frank. You demonstrated some courage in making a 300-mile shake-down run. A lot of people tend to use a 3-mile radius for initial 'de-bugging' drives.

Jeremy

Thanks Jeremy - but I did do a few of those de-bugging rides so it wasn't quite as courageous. I probably had ~30 local miles on prior to this trip. I was pretty nervous about it still though but I had to give it a go. I only had one "Oh Sh*t" moment when my transfer case popped into neutral going down a hill about 100 miles from home. I had no idea when happened at first but i lost all drive of course. Pulled over, stressed out for a second, and then realized the tcase lever looked like it was a bit forward. Problem solved. Hasn't happened again so perhaps I did something to anger it.

By the time I was driving home I was much more comfortable and even turned the radio on.

Frank84
09-17-2012, 08:42 PM
This thing is starting to look a bit like a car again - and drive like one too. I'm a little delayed in posting pictures but they really are just reassembly of the dash. I've read a few horror stories of taking these dashes apart with all the plastic breaking and it being terribly complicated. The plastic is definitely fragile, but if you don't rush you won't break it. No issues really and I have to say that it wasn't too difficult with the exception of the damn rubber strip near the windshield.

I trimmed and re-installed a little bit of the factory sound deadening wherever it wouldn't really be too visible. The diesel is louder than the V8 around town, but once out on the highway the noise level is roughly the same or even slightly quieter since I switched from mud terrains to all terrains. I think the tires made more of a difference on the highway than the engine.

Frank84
09-17-2012, 08:57 PM
The center console area is in limbo right now. It will need to be custom for a number of reasons, plus the old one was toast. I'll probably make if from some sheet metal and very roughly follow the factory shape.

I'm thinking of mounting the autometer gauge pack near the interior light above the rear view mirror. An "A Pillar" mounting solution would be cool but too much work. I don't think I want them in the center console like I originally planned since it takes an extra effort to glance down there to check on the car's vitals.

Also, the gas mileage of these things really is as good as people claim. I didn't believe it until I tried it. And yes, I corrected my odometer per my GPS on a long highway drive.

First tank, learning to drive this thing: 26.7

Second fill, 5 hours at Rausch, then back to NJ and some commuting: 25.0

Third tank, back roads commuting and some highway: 28.5

Now all I have to do is drive this thing 75k miles to break even financially...

Frank84
09-17-2012, 09:21 PM
A few pictures from the maiden voyage at Rausch after the club picnic.

The bad: A few issues came up of course.

1. I'm not sure if it is the new (but same size) tires or the softer rear springs, but the rear tires rub the inner wheel well slightly now when articulating. Not a big deal I guess.

2. I have an occasional knock underneath that happens when things get torqued up just right - something from the underdrive shifter mechanism hitting the trans tunnel it seems like.

3. Sunroof leaks like crazy all of a sudden - drains are 100% clear.

4. T-case pops out of gear. I've had this happen twice now in 900 miles or so. Both times it happened when I was going down a long hill on the highway in gear, but with my foot off the gas. Kind of annoying because I have to coast to the side of the road to shift it back in. Might not have the linkage adjusted fully? Got to investigate. Any ideas?

5. Rear pinion seal leaks now. I guess it will always leak from somewhere.


The good: Already mentioned reasonable noise level and awesome MPG's.

1. I didn't break down.

2. Smooth, comfortable cruising at 70+ mph. The Strange Rover couldn't do this before.

3. Good and bad here. Stock gears with oversize tires are great for highway cruising but suck around town on big hills. No surprise there I guess.

4. 5-speed is more fun on the trails and adds a new challenge for me to try to get the hang of.

5. Underdrive is unreal for cruising the rocks and super steep decents. Idles along at 1/2 MPH in 1st gear.

6. Did I mention it didn't break down? That was the best part of the drive. It started every time, the brakes didn't fail and nothing fell off.

Frank84
09-23-2012, 10:42 AM
Mounted my extra gage cluster on Friday. I'm not sure what this little bracket was doing originally, but it seemed like the perfect spot.

grnthng
09-24-2012, 11:45 PM
I really like that Pyrometer gauge....just like in the big rigs! I had a gauge like that on my Kenworth...it was good to know how hot your exhaust temp. was especially when pulling big hills in the summer time! If that gauge was climbing it meant you were lugging that gear and it was time to downshift to lower the temps...this was pulling 80,000 lbs ofcource!

I can relate to your tire rubbing....an issue I had and corrected with those chunky polyurethane axle bump stops! You will lose some articulation, but avoid the agrivation...of cutting tires and fenders etc.
Those bump stops also corrected my problem of having to pop my rear springs back in to place for the trip home!

redhawkrovers
09-28-2012, 02:33 PM
Frank
Nice right up and great job!
I've got to order a tunnel gaiter for my rover thats a great price from RN.
When i looked for them a while back they where 600 dollar's from rover.
look forward to the console build.
take care
Jim

Frank84
09-28-2012, 07:20 PM
I hope we're talking about the same part Jim. Rovers North charged $32.78 + shipping for the genuine land rover part. This is the thin rubber gaiter that goes around the r380 and lt230 shifters and seals up the top of the transmission tunnel. It was special ordered and took an extra week or so to come in. Well worth every penny because this would have been really tough to seal up nicely without this piece. I would have paid much more for it - but don't tell Rovers North that...

Part #AWR3286, "GAITER MANUAL SHIFTER DISCOM I"

I'm going to try to find some time to make a little progress on the console this weekend - will post picts. I also just got in my 37/64th drill bit for drilling/taping to put the original RRC V8 sender into the brass plug on the t-stat housing. Hopefully that will correct the temp gage. The EGR sensor hole in the top of the cylinder head is not the correct thread - its the same thread as the Disco sender.

EDIT - attached a picture of the gaiter

Frank84
09-30-2012, 12:12 PM
Made progress on the console this past week. Started with a cardboard template and cut out a sheet metal base plate. Made some mounts to bolt it to the trans tunnel and added some hardware to screw in place some Disco tcase shifter gaiters I had sitting around. The small gaiter on the underdrive is from a DII I think but it has been sitting around for so long I'm not 100% sure. It works though.

The cubby box has obvious origins but I stripped the hardware off it since I won't need the latch and the handle on the top would surely rattle like crazy. The window switches got their own metal mounting plate to replace the very cracked factory one - cutting precision rectangular holes wasn't much fun.

Frank84
09-30-2012, 12:25 PM
Next up was trying to get cupholders in place. Sticking with the all metal theme, I got some 3" exhaust couplers and repurposed them. It took a while to figure out how to mount them. Initially I was just going to weld them to the top but that would have looked crappy though it would have been better than the roll of duct tape I've used for the last 5 years. Then the flush look seemed like a good idea, but it added many hours and complications to the project. Ohh well.

Lots more to do on it but that's it for now.

mlp141
09-30-2012, 05:43 PM
Frank - everything is really shaping up and looking good. I wish I had fab skills. Question though. Why isn't the window panel and cup holder tray centered on the ammo can?

Frank84
09-30-2012, 05:54 PM
Frank - everything is really shaping up and looking good. I wish I had fab skills. Question though. Why isn't the window panel and cup holder tray centered on the ammo can?

Looks a little funny doesn't it? The ebrake lever comes up next to the cupholders/switches so they had to get shifted to the side. The factory one does this too but it looks a little more fluid than my attempt. The ammo can is centered in the car to just fit between the front arm rests.

rijosho
10-01-2012, 11:39 AM
Clearly you are a genius. :) Great custom work! I wonder what it would look like if you brought that center console to a faux painter who could paint the metal to match the wood trim of your dash. :cool:

Frank84
10-01-2012, 12:21 PM
haha - thanks! Maybe I can just find some faux wood stickers or a vinyl wrap. That would look sweet! (note sarcasm)

grnthng
10-01-2012, 11:51 PM
Hey Frank, I pulled these out of my crawl space to take some pics and to whipe them down with some conditioner!
Thought you might want to take a look....I noticed your dash is grey, hint..hint!!

grnthng
10-01-2012, 11:56 PM
here some more pics!

rijosho
10-03-2012, 04:25 PM
here some more pics!


Those seat bottoms don't come off, do they? The seat rails look somewhat similar to the Defender rails.

Frank84
10-03-2012, 07:01 PM
Hey Frank, I pulled these out of my crawl space to take some pics and to whipe them down with some conditioner!
Thought you might want to take a look....I noticed your dash is grey, hint..hint!!

Hmmm....my leather is in okay shape and I'm 99% certain that tan was actually the factory color in mine despite the grey-ish dash.

Frank84
10-03-2012, 07:03 PM
Those seat bottoms don't come off, do they? The seat rails look somewhat similar to the Defender rails.

Bottoms don't come off like a defender's do.

grnthng
10-04-2012, 12:44 PM
Those seat bottoms don't come off, do they? The seat rails look somewhat similar to the Defender rails.

What do you mean by "seat bottom"? If I'm thinking what your thinking....I'm afraid they will not work in a Defender! I tried to put these in my '83 and it wouldn't work....they just sat to high making for an awekward seating position because of the similiar to the Defenders seat frames!
RR's '85-'86 and up to '95 had rails welded to the floorpans proper that sat at much lower hight, these seats have a very high back!

grnthng
10-04-2012, 12:50 PM
Hmmm....my leather is in okay shape and I'm 99% certain that tan was actually the factory color in mine despite the grey-ish dash.

Yhep, my '83 also has a gray dash and also had those hidious beige velour interior!
Door cards on mine are also beige!

Ken Heaton
10-08-2012, 04:03 PM
Great Job Frank!!

Do you do your own welding?

Frank84
10-09-2012, 07:21 AM
Great Job Frank!!

Do you do your own welding?

Thanks Ken. Yes on the welding, but I'm in the learning curve still. I'm finding that it is more about how much time and care you put into the prep than how good you are at using the machine.

redhawkrovers
10-24-2012, 11:30 AM
Would those Classic door panels work on a D1? I'm slowly changing my interior to grey.

grnthng
10-27-2012, 08:57 PM
I don't think so....the doors are different on the Discos!

pushngo
10-27-2012, 09:05 PM
'95s will I believe

Frank84
11-07-2012, 08:49 PM
After taking a bit of a hiatus to go on vacation and then enjoy camping out in the house with no power, I got a few things done and made some progress on the console.

The diff lock light is installed in the trim piece that goes around the radio which seemed like the easiest spot. I think '87/88 rangies had it somewhere around there. Also, got my temp gauge working properly now by installing my old V8 sender in a plug in the engine.

Just about done with the console at this point. Got a few things to clean up but it should be able to go in the car this weekend. That thing took way longer than I had initially anticipated but at least it is pretty much done now.

Frank84
11-10-2012, 03:18 PM
Console is done!

mlp141
11-10-2012, 03:21 PM
Console is done!

Bravo! Looking good.

grnthng
11-17-2012, 10:56 PM
That looks great Frank.....You will be the envy of all truckers everywhere with all those shifters!